Slow data on 1 of 2 lines.

  • 3 February 2018
  • 39 replies
  • 187 views

I have 2 lines and am almost out of data on one so I am using the other. It is only running at 523 kbit/second. The advertising promises 4G LTE speed between 7000 kbit/sec and 90 MBit/sec. My other line measures over 10,000 kbit/sec so it is above the advertised minimum.

They have told me that the phone is wrong, the tower is too far away and that there is too much congestion. Simply changing the SIM card results in 23 times slower data so it is NOT the phone/tower/congestion/cosmic_rays/...

Here is the fast line. Note that this is downloading the Linux Kernel and averages 8237 kbit/second, but ~12 Mbit/sec at first.

The advertised speed is 7000 kbit/sec to 40,000 kbit/sec (40 MEGA_bit/second). So 8237 kbit/sec is within the advertised range.

https://www.t-mobile.com/company/company-info/consumer/internet-services.html

4G LTE Network (On-Device): Download speeds: Typically between 7 – 40 Mbps, with peaks up to 90 Mbps

Here is my alternate line, 23 times slower and well below advertised/promised speeds:

523 kbit/sec averaged over 800 readings taken ten times per second. 

Promised 7000 kbit/second MINIMUM advertised speed,  Actual 523 kbit/second.  7.5% of advertised speed or 13X below promised speed.

Have I tried customer support?

~/dat> grep Cust  tmob.voice.2018.0203.jan.txt

01/30/2018, 08:42 AM    Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  7       --

01/29/2018, 03:55 PM    Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  26      Call Waiting

01/29/2018, 02:55 PM    Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  59      --

01/16/2018, 02:25 PM    Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  68      --

12/19/17, 1:47 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  53      Free Calls      --

12/19/17, 1:31 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  15      Free Calls      --

11/25/17, 12:23 PM      Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  42      Free Calls      --

11/25/17, 12:22 PM      Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  1       Free Calls      --

11/20/17, 6:20 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  3       Free Calls      --

11/15/17, 3:24 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  141     Free Calls      --

11/09/17, 11:02 AM      Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  99      Free Calls      --

11/01/17, 1:08 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  16      Free Calls      --

11/01/17, 12:47 PM      Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  18      Free Calls      --

10/25/17, 7:50 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  25      Free Calls      --

10/16/17, 3:11 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  47      Free Calls      --

10/11/17, 5:34 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  51      Free Calls      --

10/06/17, 11:30 AM      Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  25      Free Calls      --

10/05/17, 6:37 PM       Customer Care   (877) 453-1304  2       Free Calls      --

10/05/17, 6:33 PM       Customer Care   (877) 453-1304  4       Free Calls      --

09/21/17, 7:20 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  6       Free Calls      --

09/21/17, 6:39 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  17      Free Calls      --

09/12/17, 5:38 PM       Cust Care       (800) 937-8997  18      Free Calls      --

~/dat> grep Cust  tmob.voice.2018.0203.jan.txt | psr.pl -N "s/^.*\-\d{4}\s+(\d+).*$/\$1/"  | add -s

Average=33.77, Sum=743, Count=22

I have tried 22 calls since September, over half an hour average per call for a total of 743 minutes or over 12 hours.

I wonder whether this is a world record for poor customer service.

T-Mobile, please fix my second line.

TYVM


39 replies

Userlevel 7
Badge +13

The word typically doesn't guarantee the data speeds.

Your other phone may lack the bands and that's why the speeds are slow.

Userlevel 7
Badge +12

quite possibly it could be your phone and not the service what troubleshooting has been done between the two phones and what two phones are there? Are they unlocked or T-Mobile branded devices?

Also no carrier has ever promised a minimum set of speeds because there are so many factors and to why they always say "up to" or "typically", and not "at least"

Tidbits,

>> quite possibly it could be your phone

Same phone, different SIM card

Now that Isabel fixed my line, I am now measuring 12.6 Mbit/sec averated over 600 readings and a peak speed of 21M!

It's not the phone (Nexus 6)

Earlier today, it was measuring just over 500 kbit/sec.  Earlier in the week, I was measuring 19 kbit/second.

My account settings are hosed.

  =====================

Test Results:

PGDET: 600 Readings, Elapsed time=62.501802 sec, iface_MBytes=98.561150

PGDET: Average speed = 1.577 MB/sec ~= 12615.463 kbit/sec

GRTIT: Average speed=12615.46 kbit/sec, HD_Video=ON, Phone_mode=4G_LTE

Tidbits,

This sure looks like a performance claim to me. How do you read it?

Company Information | T-Mobile’s Broadband Internet Access Services

4G LTE Network (On-Device):

  • Download speeds: Typically between 7 – 40 Mbps, with peaks up to 90 Mbps and minimum expected speeds of less than .1 Mbps

Do you think that the "< .1 Mbps" "weasel term" complies with "you must have at least that level of support" federal advertising regulation?

Do you think Ford would get away with claiming 21 miles/gallon (but we may actually only provide  LESS THAN 0.3 miles/gallon)?

I think this Federal Trade Commission rule applies:

Advertising and Marketing on the Internet: Rules of the Road | Federal Trade Commission

claims must be substantiated, especially when they concern health, safety, or performance. The type of evidence may depend on the product, the claims, and what experts believe necessary. If your ad specifies a certain level of support for a claim - "tests show X" - you must have at least that level of support.

They were claiming 7000 MINIMUM and I was measuring 19. Do you think this is "Close Enough"?  If I owe you $7000, can I slide by with paying you just $19?

When there are multiple variables, just like with Gas Mileage, the claim MUST be on the conservative side or it is FALSE ADVERTISING.

When a customer can show conclusively that T-Mobile's performance is less than advertised, T-Mobile is ethically and in every other way obligated to do anything even remotely reasonable to provide the stated level of performance.

I have to do this every month.

Userlevel 7
Badge +12

Cars have an  say 31 City and often a lot of them do not hit 31 consistently.  Same deal my friend.  Good luck with that argument.  Typical is not MINIMAL.  Go and try that with a judge or the FCC, and you will find out what you are assuming regardless of carrier is not how it works when it comes to False advertising regulations.  T-Mobile can show those test and judge could look through the web and see screenshots and what not out there to show T-Mobile network can hit those marks if not higher.  Then it would come down to other factors as potentially why you are not getting those speeds.  Case dismissed win the carrier(has been this way for in various industries).

No I do not work for T-Mobile.  I have done quite a few False advertising class action lawsuits in the past 30 years of my life.

I have to agree with tidbits here it clearly states on the terms and conditions that speeds are subject to geographical limits landscape limits etc so t mobile can't guarantee that the speeds would be 7-40mbps all the time

Tidbits,

These "typical" estimates are arrived at after extensive testing. A 95% certainty envelope is calculated for the data and the conservative lower bound is established such that not more than 5% of samples would be expected to fall below this estimate.  It is known as the "2 Sigma Rule".

Measured performance of 19 kbit/sec compared to "typical" minimum range of 7000 kbits/sec (368.421053 times higher) falls slightly outside the confidence envelope.

You may wish to review this with a math person:

https://www3.epa.gov/ttnemc01/news/appdixc.pdf   << EPA Mileage estimate calculations

Similarly, phone companies, regulated by the same Federal Trade Commission have to follow these same guidelines or risk protracted litigation with the Feds.

Here's hoping that you win an action in the next 30 years.  😊

@landonloco

Your  "subject to geographical limits landscape limits"' excuse falls flat when the nice tech lady can flip a switch on her end and change my line from 19kbps  to  12,000kbps.

Did she somehow flatten the hills between here and there? Drop a new tower in my back yard?  Suddenly place a geosynchronous satellite exactly over my house?

Or, is there some horrible misconfiguration issue that frequently sets  my account to 1G speed when it CAN DO 4G LTE speed?

Which is more likely?

Userlevel 6
Badge +12

I also just want to chime in and say you have misunderstood the fine print since I reread what you link to be sure. You also seem to misunderstand how the network works and why its impossible to guarantee a set speed with any wireless network not just T-mobile. If you need help trouble shooting don't be afraid to ask but in the mean time I wouldn't hold my breath or waste energy over a lawsuit or whatever you had in mind.

It just a network reset that just forces the phone to connect to other towers if the phone connects to other one that isn't congested speeds will improve

Dragon,

>> you have misunderstood the fine print

Clearly, it is you who fail to understand the governing, federal law:

If your ad specifies a certain level of support for a claim - "tests show X" - you must have at least that level of support.

Are you familiar with the meaning of the term "at least".  Try re-re-rereading...

It was tidbit who was bragging about his myriad lawsuits in the past decades (never mentioned winning any). My point was that the FTC can sue if repeated and flagrant violations are reported.  I am NOT the FTC.

Your legalese fine point that nobody can promise 100.000000000% performance 100.000000% of the  time is meaningless. I am not peeved about getting only 99.9% of advertised claims, but rather about getting 19 when promised 7000 kbps.

Is this too fine a distinction for  you to grok?

And, it's a configuration issue at T-Mobile because, as shown in the graphs, the speed went from 19 to 12,000 kbits with a flip of a switch by T-Mobile.  This happens every week.

If it's a account problem the only thing I can think of is the de prioritizing cap of 50GB

Userlevel 6
Badge +12

4G LTE Network (On-Device):

  • Download speeds: Typically between 7 – 40 Mbps, with peaks up to 90 Mbps and minimum expected speeds of less than .1 Mbps
  • Upload speeds: Typically between 4 – 20 Mbps, with peaks up to 35 Mbps and minimum expected speeds of less than .1 Mbps
  • Latency: Typically between 30 – 55 ms

4G LTE Network (Via Smartphone Mobile HotSpot/Tethering, for Plans Including 4G LTE Tethering):

  • Download Speed: Typically between 3 – 25 Mbps, with peaks up to 90 Mbps and minimum expected speeds of less than .1 Mbps
  • Upload Speed: Typically between 2 – 10 Mbps, with peaks up to 35 Mbps and minimum expected speeds of less than .1 Mbps
  • Latency: Typically between 30 – 55 ms

This was copied straight form the link you provided.  T-mobile never promised you 7mb. They clear say at the end "minimum expected speeds of less than .1mbps.

Also I honestly must ask why you are here? I get the impression that you believe to know it all and you seem to be arguing with everyone that just wants to help you. I know my grammer is not the best but that is no reason to talk down to me.

landonloco,

>> a network reset  ...  will improve

Given the choice between spending half an your on the phone with tech support or rebooting the phone, any sane person would choose the 1 minute reboot.

It has never once helped and I have tried it many times.  No Cigar!

>> Must be your fault:  I can think of is the depriode prioritizing cap of 50GB

From https://my.t-mobile.com/usage/usageoverview.html

6.30 GB  of Unlimited high-speed

Not even close.  You are off in the weeds today!

You need to give up trying to make up flimsy excuses for Titanically Terrible Phone Service.  Service 368 times slower than advertised is INDEFENSIBLE!

Case Closed!

Userlevel 7
Badge +12

patrickphotog wrote:

Dragon,

>> you have misunderstood the fine print

Clearly, it is you who fail to understand the governing, federal law:

If your ad specifies a certain level of support for a claim - "tests show X" - you must have at least that level of support.

Are you familiar with the meaning of the term "at least". Try re-re-rereading...

It was tidbit who was bragging about his myriad lawsuits in the past decades (never mentioned winning any). My point was that the FTC can sue if repeated and flagrant violations are reported. I am NOT the FTC.

Your legalese fine point that nobody can promise 100.000000000% performance 100.000000% of the time is meaningless. I am not peeved about getting only 99.9% of advertised claims, but rather about getting 19 when promised 7000 kbps.

Is this too fine a distinction for you to grok?

And, it's a configuration issue at T-Mobile because, as shown in the graphs, the speed went from 19 to 12,000 kbits with a flip of a switch by T-Mobile. This happens every week.

Of course we didn't win, because perceptions doesn't win cases.  Like I said if it was false advertising and you believe you had a clear case you'd just go with the lawsuit and free yourself instead of trying to bully to get what you want.  That in on itself gives reasonable doubt you have a case. 

Go ahead and try it and see what happens.  You were never promised 7mbps.

Userlevel 7
Badge +12

Are you tethering?

Well if the problem  isn't the cap then you are just experiencing extreme congestion did you check the data usage dialing #data# this provides data usage including bing on data if it's still below 50GB it could be the device or as stated extreme congestion if speeds doesn't satisfy you you could switch carriers and I be honest all carriers experience at some point from network congestion in my area both t mobile and AT&T have congestion issues

Tidbits

>> just go with the lawsuit

you are the only one mentioning 30 years of lost lawsuits. I simply quoted the rules of the road governing fair advertising.

>> instead of trying to bully ...

How dare you accuse me of bullying. To bully is to take unfair advantage from a position of superiority.

In an intellectual clash of ideas, you can only be bullied if you are unarmed.    😥

l @landonloco

>> could be the device or as stated extreme congestion

Did you read the part about how Isabel flipped a switch and within seconds, the speed went from 500 kbits to 12,000 kbits?

Did her switch flipping fix my device?  It is NOT my phone.

Did she hang up on everybody else clogging the network so I could get through?  She didn't suddenly fix network congestion!

Is there some extreme, recurring configuration problem with My Account that has to be fixed every few days.

Telling a paying customer to either accept bad service or to "switch carriers" should be a terminable offense,  the Zenith of Bad Customer Service.  The Corrections Industry is looking for forward thinkers!

The flip the switch as a you said it's just a network reset or line refresh it has different names it normally just forces the phone to connect to the best signal that speeds jump that you see does it stays at 12mbps or does it goes back to 500kbps after a couple minutes if so then that's probably with the tower that you are connected at the time did any of the reps that you have talked to did they file a trouble ticket for you

@landonloco

>> does it stays at 12mbps

I am reading 7.8 on Fast.com just now. Wow!  I would be happy as a clam if it would just stay "around" here!

Surely, rebooting the phone "forces the phone to connect to the best signal". In 101+ attempts, rebooting has never made any noticeable difference.

As I have stated above, I have placed 23 tech support calls totaling  over 12 hours of my time since 9/12/2017. The very knowledgeable Tech Support Supervisor, Raymond, told me that my account was screwed up and created yet another support ticket. 

Here is another clue;  Having T-Mobile techs set the profile->media_settings->HD_Video_Resolution to ON 100% fixes the problem in under a minute, every time. It still reads OFF on my.t-mobile.com and clicking on it only prints this error message,"Something went wrong and we were unable to process your request.". But, I do get a text message about purchasing HD video and it shows up on my bill.

So, the only way to get the $60 level advertised performance is to $85 plan.

The specifics of my situation reminds me of this:

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business.../advertising-faqs ...

Bait and Switch. How does the FTC define "bait and switch" advertising? It's illegal to advertise a product when the company has no intention of selling that item, but instead plans to sell a consumer something else, usually at a higher price.

And, there is a bunch more fascinating reading about the topic; use of bait and switch techniques, failure to perform promised services, systematically defective products or services, ... on FTC.gov.  Riveting!

I have the LTE Discovery app and it tells me the GPS coords of my tower as well as shows the distance of 5938m and points an arrow in toward it. Very slick. Always the same tower.

LTE: -109.0 dBm, band 12, but sometimes briefly jumps to band 4. Usually 3/4 bars. Always 2+.

Rather than having me monitor their performance and spend half an hour on the phone every few days to repeatedly get it fixed, how hard would it be to run a "CRON" job to automagically check up on these extremely problematic lines and have the system flip the switch as needed to maintain the advertised customer experience. 

Think of how much less strain on T-Mobilers if a running a simple checkup script could get one major crackpot off the support line and web page!

Capital Idea!!!!!

Mmm that's quite odd bing on/standard quality video toggle only limits video streams to 1.5mbps anything else should be running at the available speeds.The speed test page that you use is affected by the HD toggle I know this suggestion sounds crazy but did try to suspend the line for 24 hours to see if any problem regarding your line reverts back only bad thing tho is that you would have to pay the reconnection fee of 20$ or if you phone is pay off on the last day of the billing cycle you could cancel the line entirely

And activate it again

Userlevel 6

Hey, @patrickphotog​! There is definitely a lot to take in here -- and it looks like you've really been through the ringer trying to get to the bottom of this.

You mentioned that at one point a representative was able to improve this somehow -- and then it slowed again? I also think you mentioned that when you place a different (T-Mobile?) SIM in the same device, the speed issues aren't happening. Could this be an issue with the SIM itself, or an issue with a speed reduction -- over any of the calls in, have we taken a look at the line in question and mentioned that the line's been de-prioritized? When you mentioned changing the SIM, were you referencing updating to a new T-Mobile SIM, or just placing a different line's active T-Mobile SIM in the phone that's having the speed trouble?

Userlevel 7
Badge +12

Are you tethering?  What plan do you guys have? 

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